16 replies to this topic

[hoffy]

howdy all,

I am not going to make it a secret that I prefer the original idea of running the Down Under proxy (when it was called the auslot proxy back in 06) & that is a basic RTR package, with tuning.

Sure, it has evolved over 2 years to broaden the rules a bit, but regardless, I am still interested to see how other people would like to compete. Not everyone thinks there is enough challange in RTR's. Not everyone wants to scratch build.

Anyhow, just to define my poll questions (so you know what you are voting for!):

• Scratch Built only Man - Exactly as it says. Could involve using the basics from an RTR, fitting a different chassis. Could also involve using a Resin Body & scratch building a chassis from brass & piano wire...& could include every possible permiation between
  
• Mix & Match, Cut & Shut - A variation of the scratch built theme, to a degree. Could include swapping one chassis from one car to another, using HRS chassis, changing a car from an inline to a side winder, cutting out the motor mount & installing a pod, etc, etc. I suppose the basis would be parts that are readily available & fitting them together to make a demon slotcar
  
• Tuned RTR - This would basically mean taking one slotcar & tuning it, without making wholesale changes to the body & chassis. You could still leave it open enough to change running gear (including motors), making sure that the chassis fits &/or has movement when loosening the body screws, adding weight to tune, etc, but restrict it to original motor position & body mounts
  
• Dont care what you do - Any of the above

Obviously, these suggestions would require some thought, opening up &/or restriction. It would just be interesting to see what others think!

Also, if you are a proxy beginner or have never entered a proxy, dont be afraid to give your opinion as well.

Finally, please, please do not take this as the be all & end all for this years proxy discussion. It is to be used for discussion & could also be used for the basis of future proxy series, regardless of them being DUPR or something different/new (I.E., the rally proxy, etc)

Cheers

[espsix]

I voted for the "tuned rtr", mainly because i'm alittle bit lazy, so it's easier to just make the basic car better, than chopping and changing heaps.
Plus it gives hope to the new guys, (who have never know the scratch built type cars) that they can enter, and if they've got the right bits, in the right car, they in with a shot. (i know people will argue that it's not about winning, but having fun by joining in, but it's not as much fun when you've got no chance of winning).
But what ever happens will be fine by me!

[rick1776]

A one make RTR series and as I said in the other thread why not make it V8 supercars. Just imagine the wealth of knowledge that will be gained on how to set these cars up so that they perform well on lots of different tracks. Oh and make it a control tyre just like the real ones.

Easy to implement, no need to chop up cars to fit into esoteric categories, even Eno would stand a chance of doing well all he has to do is part company with a box stock standard V8. Or he could tune it but it would be a lot slower as a consequence.

Im sure there will still be a large spread in lap times depending on what set up suits a particular track.

cheers
rick1776

[gah5]

Being a relative newby, I went with the tuned RTR, not quite sure I possess the knowledge to cut & shut or scratch build

[oldslot]

I went for tuned rtr with the proviso that we drop the original motor mount rule as there are quite a few cars around that benefit greatly by having the motor relocated, mainly fly with the front or behind the axle mounting thats my thoughts for what there worth

[Antony]

I thought last year's rules were pretty good, allowed you to run a tuned RTR or fit a resin body onto a donor Fly classic chassis. This gave a gave a good opportunty to newcomers while allowing those with some skills to flex their muscles and enter something different albeit only on a specified RTR chassis.

If the series were to go 55-68 Sports GT then maybe the donor chassis could be Ninco classic this time. What I am trying to say is that I feel the DUPR should be open to RTR but have some scope for building something different preferably on an RTR chassis. But hey I'll vote for don't care.

[Eno the Wonderdog]

rick1776, on Jul 16 2008, 02:15 PM, said:

Easy to implement, no need to chop up cars to fit into esoteric categories, even Eno would stand a chance of doing well all he has to do is part company with a box stock standard V8. Or he could tune it but it would be a lot slower as a consequence.

I'm happy for any rules.

However I'd like to have rules so that guys that want to scratchbuild can do so & we can all marvel and so that mugs like me can potter about with my RTR and wreck it and run about at the back. Perhaps if it were a 'stock tyre and such and such motor' rule with the rest being open slather (within a particular class of course). Hell you could buy a box of sealed motors and post them around at random if you wanted to.

[lenny broke]

Howdy
I voted for option D I reckon I'm a bit of a proxy nutter. trouble is I've got all these half finished cars sitting here because of missed deadlines. spose i shouldn't complain that Phil may have gone early on dupr 09 then should I.
I like the idea that DUPR is a RTR based series and I think the scratchbuilt scene is well serviced by other series like Phil's World Proxy Series and Tassie Targa Races.

The trend in DUPR so far has been to change the rules a bit each year and a different class. I don't think we should run multple classes, keep it just one , anybody who was involved in last years global proxy would know it was a fairly long night. perhaps we could alternate year about tuned RTR and Cut and shut,
just some random thought
Cheers Alan

[x19]

Tuned RTR. As a newbie this appeals to me- its what I try and do already and am interested to see if I'm on the right track- compared to those with experience...

[wizardgm]

hoffy, on Jul 16 2008, 12:52 PM, said:

howdy all,

I am not going to make it a secret that I prefer the original idea of running the Down Under proxy (when it was called the auslot proxy back in 06) & that is a basic RTR package, with tuning.

Sure, it has evolved over 2 years to broaden the rules a bit, but regardless, I am still interested to see how other people would like to compete. Not everyone thinks there is enough challange in RTR's. Not everyone wants to scratch build.

Anyhow, just to define my poll questions (so you know what you are voting for!):

• Scratch Built only Man - Exactly as it says. Could involve using the basics from an RTR, fitting a different chassis. Could also involve using a Resin Body & scratch building a chassis from brass & piano wire...& could include every possible permiation between
  
• Mix & Match, Cut & Shut - A variation of the scratch built theme, to a degree. Could include swapping one chassis from one car to another, using HRS chassis, changing a car from an inline to a side winder, cutting out the motor mount & installing a pod, etc, etc. I suppose the basis would be parts that are readily available & fitting them together to make a demon slotcar
  
• Tuned RTR - This would basically mean taking one slotcar & tuning it, without making wholesale changes to the body & chassis. You could still leave it open enough to change running gear (including motors), making sure that the chassis fits &/or has movement when loosening the body screws, adding weight to tune, etc, but restrict it to original motor position & body mounts
  
• Dont care what you do - Any of the above

Obviously, these suggestions would require some thought, opening up &/or restriction. It would just be interesting to see what others think!

Also, if you are a proxy beginner or have never entered a proxy, dont be afraid to give your opinion as well.

Finally, please, please do not take this as the be all & end all for this years proxy discussion. It is to be used for discussion & could also be used for the basis of future proxy series, regardless of them being DUPR or something different/new (I.E., the rally proxy, etc)

Cheers

Hoffy,
congratulations on a well thought-out discussion starter !!

I voted for the Tuned RTR cars.... Why ? read on.... ( I apologise, in advance, if I waffle on a bit )

Firstly (IMO) I think that Scratch-building precludes (and intimidates) many newbie’s from attempting to get into the subject of proxy racing.
Even though I have been scratch-building for MANY years, these proxy races have even made me stop, look, listen and learn (by being involved as a driver of the 2007 & qualifier / driver of the 2008 proxy cars), before I even think of getting into this side of slot racing.

If you run the series as a tuned RTR car (and continue as such in the ongoing years), then any NEWBIE can get involved and easily get better at it.

My suggestion, is that you could add a rule that the place-getters (1st, 2nd & 3rd) in the previous year, need to create and publish an article on the building of their proxy car and make this available in these forums, (before they can enter next year’s series), so that the newbie’s can see how the winning cars were created !!

This would mean that entrants need to plan this build article as they are creating last year’s cars !!!....

This article would then help, not ONLY the newbie’s, but ALL (and future) entrants to build a competitive proxy car.

The upside would be that ALL cars would get better, the good ones at a slower rate that the not so good....

The downside is that the good builders will give away some secrets (depending on how truthfully they write their articles ), but they will also learn from their opposition builders ...

I have just written an article on a 'Tuned RTR' car (Scaley JGTC) that I have just built and am using in the 'South City Raceways' series, that I am prepared to make available as an example....
(someone will need to help me upload the word document, as I haven’t figured it out yet )

Anyway, that is my 20 cents worth, and I hope this will entice more people to add comments into this discussion....
Dennis

[chenglaw]

I would go for Tuned RTR, remembering how well my little standard Sloter Lola went in the early part of last year's series. Being basically one lazy bugger, I would prefer to keep the chopping and changing to a minimum and just make setup changes to the car, i.e. changing tyres, motor, gears and maybe guide plus adding some lead in the right places. I think the bodyshell and chassis should be restricted to the standard units as allowing a change to resin bodyshells will open up possibilities for improvement in handling over the standard unit if a wider shell is chosen, giving the advantage to the more experienced builder over a relative newbie.

I feel that the scratch building proxy should be left to Phil's WPR series which have been successful thus far. If those of you in Oz do not feel comfortable about having your toy travelling half way round the world competing against other strange cars then maybe Phil could be persuaded to run a scratch-built series restricted to Down Under tracks only (if he can find the time and dates).

Whatever the format you guys eventually go for, I'm game for it.

[HoMErN13]

I voted Tuned RTR because im a newbie and want to get involved, but dont yet have the experience to build my own cars

[kalbfellp]

Lim: It looks like what was the WPR is dead! It will now only be a Tassie race with possible a couple of rounds on the North Island.

The First proxy race was for tuned RTR cars, maybe some still hase the rules? Last years race was opened up after much discussion and this years was opened even more simply because of the lack of RTR cars.
The class selected also tends to dictate some of the chassis rules. IE the LMP class has some very nice tunable chassied cars available and they would be the pick to run.
BUT a class based around Ninco classics would be a lot more limited in chassis choice.

As far as build articles goes it is a great idea. The scratch built races that I organised I spent many hours collating details and pics of all of the cars.


Targa Proxy
Can Am WPR

Click cars for info.
wizardgm Is this the type of info you would like?


Steve has also ask me to try and put something together on this years race.

Phil

Edited by kalbfellp, 17 July 2008 - 11:25 PM.

[chenglaw]

kalbfellp, on Jul 17 2008, 09:17 PM, said:

Lim: It looks like what was the WPR is dead! It will now only be a Tassie race with possible a couple of rounds on the North Island.

The First proxy race was for tuned RTR cars, maybe some still hase the rules? Last years race was opened up after much discussion and this years was opened even more simply because of the lack of RTR cars.
The class selected also tends to dictate some of the chassis rules. IE the LMP class has some very nice tunable chassied cars available and they would be the pick to run.
BUT a class based around Ninco classics would be a lot more limited in chassis choice.

As far as build articles goes it is a great idea. The scratch built races that I organised I spent many hours collating details and pics of all of the cars.


Targa Proxy
Can Am WPR

Click cars for info.
wizardgm Is this the type of info you would like?


Steve has also ask me to try and put something together on this years race.

Phil

I believe these were the rules of the first DUPR series in 2006 drawn up by Martin:

1. Magnets - Not allowed

2. Bodies
A - 1990 and newer GT/GTS bodies
B - Must have an interior and driver, lexan okay
C - All bodies must have racing numbers
D - All cars must have all windows, lexan ok
E - No resin bodies allowed

3. Tyres
A - Tyres are open to any brand of rubber tyre. This means no silicone tyres like PPR Super tyres, Slot.it S1's, Puma Paws, Indy Grips, NSRs etc. Rubber tyres include Ninco, SCX, FLY, Scalextric, Cartrix, Proslot, Slot.it P Series, Ortmanns. (This is not a complete list, if you know of a tyre that is rubber based let me know.)
B - Tyres should not run outside of the widest part of the cars body work.
C - No foam content allowed in the tyres.

4. Chassis
A - Original RTR chassis of the same body of the car. Chassis can be modified but it must be one piece between the axles. No Slot.it chassis on a Scalextric body for example
B - No aftermarket or scratch-built chassis allowed, plastic or otherwise.
C - Motor may be in a motor pod and separate from the chassis like a FLY or Proslot chassis.
D - Motor can be installed into a chassis that originally did not have a motor pod.
E - Minimum clearance of 1.6mm or 1/16 of an inch

5. Weight
No limit on weight.

6. Motors
Any motor can be used.

7. Modifications to cars during the race
A - Once a car is entered, its can not be changed during the race unless in the event of a mechanical failure. If a change is required to be made for the car to continue, a points penalty is to be deducted from the cars overall points. The points values will be worked out once the points structure has been determined before the first leg of the race. Screws will be checked, tyres and braids cleaned and set before each leg of the race by the track hosts, no penalty for this.

8. Misc
A - Wheels, axles, gears, guides and braids open to any brand you like.
B - Owner’s name must be written on chassis.

I had intended to put in an entry but the lack of suitable tyres for my Auto Art 4WD Lambo Gallardo at that time put paid to it. If we can revert to basically the same rules I think it will keep the playing field level for just about everyone.

[hoffy]

The website is gone, but the gist of the rules still exist here:

2006 Proxy Thread

[Sports Racer]

Every year we go through the same things - what type of cars, what type of chassis, what modifications are allowed. Why not take a leaf out of the Canadian Proxy and use the same cars and same rules each year. The only difference is each year the eligible cars move up a year ie. for 2009 cars built up to 1969 can be used. The year after they will allow cars built to 1970 and so on and so forth. This makes for a very easy entry for newbies as they can see what worked last year before building a car. Those that are more skilled are more willing to experiment as they know exactly what works and how well it works.

Cheers

Paul K

[wizardgm]

kalbfellp, on Jul 17 2008, 10:47 PM, said:

As far as build articles goes it is a great idea. The scratch built races that I organised I spent many hours collating details and pics of all of the cars.
Targa Proxy
Can Am WPR

Click cars for info.
wizardgm Is this the type of info you would like?
Phil

Phil,

yes this information is good, but not exactly as I was thinking. ( I did not know about the TARGA PROXY)

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