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Setting Up a Slot.it Nissan Skyline GTR 32

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As these are designed to run against the European DTM models, I started setting one up. I have found it naturally sits a bit higher, which for us wood track types is not desirable. 

Rear track is "almost" as wide as the Opel and the later Alfas & Merc, the height is 3mm higher than the Opel, 2mm lower than the Alfas. 
So it is well in the mix for competitive proportions.

It comes with a couple of extras under the box. One of these is a single pipe big barrel exhaust, which looks very nice when swapped in for the dual pipe. But once I had lowered the chassis, it could scrape the track, so I reverted to the dual pipe.

The other item is a pair of small sort of triangular plastic pieces, designed for fitting under the chassis. The specified effect of these is to enable the front corners of the chassis to touch the track when cornering and "slide" - That is what they tell me. But due to the rigid way I set up the front axle, with no rock, these cannot touch anyway so make no difference. But I fitted them INSIDE the body, and some way that eludes me, they have improved the way the body rocks, so there they shall stay.  You can see them fitted to the top side of the  chassis in the second picture.

As you can see in the pic below, the black guide is visible through the clear plastic setup plate, and is sitting full depth. I have the front with about 1.25mm clearance after truing down the front tyres, and with the axle set as high as possible in the mounting posts.

The back is lower through, as I have raised the pod up inside the car 1.0mm. To do this raising and ensure the tyres don't foul on the underside of the interior, I trued them a little more than needed, and took a little material off the underside of the interior where the wheels approach the interior.
- That interior already has shaping to create working space for tyres, but needed a little more help :)

dtms3.jpg

A few tidy ups to do - if anyone compares my lead-work to that of a drunken free form sculptor, I shall take mortal offence - but agree with you.
It looks like a lot, but it is only 0.8mm sheet.  Car weight is 84 grams.  I could now probably do away with the 4gm square underneath the lead connector, and the cheater -weight extra magnet in front of the motor (1.2gm) . Those will be tested in the coming days.

The pod has actually been raised inside the chassis that full 1mm by the placement of rubber washers between the underside of the pod legs and the upper side of the chassis. I'd have been happier with 0.5mm ones, but I have been unable to source, and the supply from benefactor who gave me some 0.5mm a couple of ears back, is almost exhausted.

dtms5.jpg

I have also replaced the Slot.it body screws with another I prefer for fit of my screwdriver, the amount of smooth shaft, and have replaced the steel washers with rubber ones. I prefer the cushioning effect with the body float.

The front has a little over 1mm clearance, the rear a little under 1mm. The guide is full depth.

dtms4.jpg

It is getting close in lap times to my fully developed Alfas, so when the motor is fully run in, it should be competitive.
In the wild.

dtms2.jpg
 

And hanging with it's mates
dtms.jpg


Walks upright Unaided  *  Ties Own Shoelaces  *  Can Mispronounce Own Name In Five Languages  *  Mostly Aims Rattle Cans Away from Self
 My Track Oakland Raceway V2     Our Club  HMBRC     

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Great minds nearly think alike Mark did a small write up in a similar vein in Slotforum, i presume you cut the 4 side chassis stops of as well

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Nice work, Mark.... too many people simply pretty much run cars OTB... with very little attention to tuning them.

I do like your application of using rubber washers for body mount screws... must source some.

Are you still running the Slot-It tyres?... I noted a significant difference when swapping them out for MJK's... as fitted to the half dozen or so GT40's that I have.

Another thing that I found got just that little bit more out of it was to "re-learn" the plastic chassis - if it's not perfectly flat.... big job, but makes for a better model - probably equally in aesthetic but also to a lesser degree with performance.... 

Adjustable front axle position and pod, of course negates much of this - but to begin tuning with a flat and true chassis goes a long way to getting everything to line up square and in a parallel plane.

 

Again - nice work... bet you can't wait for that motor to settle down - easy does it.... first hour or so is just so pivotal on how long it will stay at peak performance during its life...

I have retaken the step to running in my motors in a demineralised water bath.... air drying and re-lubing.... only those motors which I can access them..... I have found that it beds in the commutator better, in my opinion... flushing away those early fragments which score and permanently mark the commutator...

If I can access the commutator - I also use "naptha" to polish it.. but, it's dangerous stuff and very volatile... hurry up and slow down to do the job... 

 

frats,

Rosco

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On 12/2/2020 at 10:46 AM, rosco01 said:

Nice work, Mark.... too many people simply pretty much run cars OTB... with very little attention to tuning them.

I do like your application of using rubber washers for body mount screws... must source some.

Are you still running the Slot-It tyres?... I noted a significant difference when swapping them out for MJK's... as fitted to the half dozen or so GT40's that I have.

Another thing that I found got just that little bit more out of it was to "re-learn" the plastic chassis - if it's not perfectly flat.... big job, but makes for a better model - probably equally in aesthetic but also to a lesser degree with performance.... 

Adjustable front axle position and pod, of course negates much of this - but to begin tuning with a flat and true chassis goes a long way to getting everything to line up square and in a parallel plane.

 

Again - nice work... bet you can't wait for that motor to settle down - easy does it.... first hour or so is just so pivotal on how long it will stay at peak performance during its life...

I have retaken the step to running in my motors in a demineralised water bath.... air drying and re-lubing.... only those motors which I can access them..... I have found that it beds in the commutator better, in my opinion... flushing away those early fragments which score and permanently mark the commutator...

If I can access the commutator - I also use "naptha" to polish it.. but, it's dangerous stuff and very volatile... hurry up and slow down to do the job... 

 

frats,

Rosco

Good additional thoughts for readers. 

Ah,  I think tyres are selective to each environment, so didn't specifically mention them.
We have all smooth surface wood tracks in our local club, and try to clean them before use to keep dust free, then use tape boards during the evening to take off anything that may have gotten onto them - mainly marbles / dust shed from other cars, or out of the slot.

Urethanes like MJK, Paul Gage, Ortmanns don't have enough grip for our preferences in that surface environment.
Locally we use a mixture of NSR Ultragrip (15-16 shore) , Slot.it N22 (22 shore - obviously) and smaller amounts of Sideways Hi Grip soft (18 shore).
Our club also decided fairly early on, that evil oils and treatments would be legal ..... it is what it is.
But we all, also know what works best, which are NSR tyre oil and/or a little CRC226 or WD40.
So tyres are further softened with these after truing. We don't (to my knowledge) have anyone using anything else.
We use each others cleaning pads etc at club, so it is all even, and doesn't cause us any issues or conflict at club.

In the past, Ultragrips ruled supreme, but most of the classes where I now have a podium car, are actually on N22s - Group C;  Scalextric BTCC, DTM, Nascar, Ozzie Touring car (AKA XB/XC Falcooooon kingdom LOL),  In 65-80 sports, I have a Slot.it Matra on N22, and an NSR 908 on Ultragrip, and week to week, track to track, it can be either which shines during practice, so I run either.
In our open motor classes GT1, Group 5, and in old Scalextric F1 I always run wide rims and wide tyres, so Ultragrip have the size range and extra grip I need - 12mm plus.

I used to flatten all chassis as a matter of course, but now examine each car to decide whether it needs it. 
Of my 8 DTM cars in total, I think only 3 showed any possible need to flatten the chassis. We don't seem to get as many that need it these days as say 5 or 6 years back. 
And I'm lazy, if I CAN avoid it.... I will.

I SHOULD run motors in, but it falls under the same category as chassis flattening. I am terminally lazy. If GIRI App says it is developing roughly spec. rpm at 12V, all it gets is a couple of squirts of Voodoo juice in the first hour of use/abuse :):)
Naptha's not toooooo bad, we just buy it as lighter fluid at the local hardware chain..... thanks for reminding me, I'm out.
 


Walks upright Unaided  *  Ties Own Shoelaces  *  Can Mispronounce Own Name In Five Languages  *  Mostly Aims Rattle Cans Away from Self
 My Track Oakland Raceway V2     Our Club  HMBRC     

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On 12/2/2020 at 9:46 AM, Peter Gunn said:

Great minds nearly think alike Mark did a small write up in a similar vein in Slotforum, i presume you cut the 4 side chassis stops of as well

Nope.  

And here is the perverse thing. Those small sliders/whiskers in the packet under the box, are definitely MEANT to go UNDER the chassis, so the front corners of the chassis touch the track, and reduce chassis roll.
Maurizio says that is because the chassis design mirrors the look of the actual car, and the chassis sat quite high. They did nothing for me with a stiff 4 wheel planted wood setup. 

But after Dopamine quipped maybe they go above, I tried it, and whatever they touch/'restrict in terms of body roll, they have settled that car down like baby tonic full of ethanol....
It feels a different car.. I have since taken the body off, looked, mused, looked again, put it back together, adjusted the body screws differently TRIED to make it unstable again .... nope, SOMETHING those sliders have caused by incorrectly mounting them above the chassis, has solved my issue of rollover. 
It is running flatter, and more importantly, the limit of cornering speed is now quite predicable, with a little forgiveness. 

I am going to do a sergeant Shultz on this one "I know nussing, I see nussing"  - it works, and that is all I care.


Walks upright Unaided  *  Ties Own Shoelaces  *  Can Mispronounce Own Name In Five Languages  *  Mostly Aims Rattle Cans Away from Self
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Odd i have found mounting those sliders under the car they don't seem to do anything at all but make the front look lower , have fitted a thinner softer braid and weighted the chassis 60--40 , i am using the 23k motor in mine wanted to save a 21 for a proxy race and the chassis is really running well with Yellowdogs on the back nice bit of bite but gives me a slight controlable movement accelerating out of corners left gearing as standard and the brakes are really good .

The white body kit has a seperate black front, spoiler and back, which has decided me to do another Black Widow type livery , just waiting for the right temp, to cold and damp at the moment

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Very similar setups Keith. So you have the weight firmly on the front wheels?  And grubs setting the height top and bottom, so that there is no axle tilting in front (like me) ? 
Those sliders UNDER wouldn't touch the track, so as you say, won't do anything, - apart from looking quite nice. 
But this mounting them above is like pixie dust, shouldn't do anything, definitely has... I just hate not understanding why - they MUST be creating limited body rock that happens to be the sweet spot for it, but I can't figure out the actual cause of the effect.
If I didn't see it for myself, I wouldn't believe it. 


Walks upright Unaided  *  Ties Own Shoelaces  *  Can Mispronounce Own Name In Five Languages  *  Mostly Aims Rattle Cans Away from Self
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I have given this chassis a very heavy work out , and have decided on a weight of 58-01 gr running with the slot it 23k most of my weight is towards the front , in the V area behind the guide post and a larger square piece between the front axle and the pod , and a piece behind the motor in that well for a magnet found this has given me a very nice fast handling chassis, and now on a par with the Calibra , not had any dip of the front corners in the bends runs as flat as a pancake, so cannot work out why those 2 bits of plastic exist.

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On 12/6/2020 at 10:21 AM, Peter Gunn said:

I have given this chassis a very heavy work out , and have decided on a weight of 58-01 gr running with the slot it 23k most of my weight is towards the front , in the V area behind the guide post and a larger square piece between the front axle and the pod , and a piece behind the motor in that well for a magnet found this has given me a very nice fast handling chassis, and now on a par with the Calibra , not had any dip of the front corners in the bends runs as flat as a pancake, so cannot work out why those 2 bits of plastic exist.

Just spotted this post Keith - what does "decided on a weight of 58-01 gr"  mean. ie, what s 58 and what is 1 ? 
The continentals apparently run with floppy front axles, allowing the front of the chassis to slide on a plastic track. Because the Skyline chassis sits higher than other DTMs, that can cause rollover. Irrelevant to us if we lower, true, and set the front axle so it cannot rock.
But for the unknown reason, fitted above the chassis, it has definitely helped my body rock stability.
I may take them back out and try using some foam to limit body rock/float, but that shouldn't be an issue anyway with the 2 front screw setup. So it has me a bit beat.


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Hi Mark typing error should read 85-01 all up weight and should have added 60-40 bias towards the front, odd car this one feels like driving something from a few years back but as it is well run in now going very nicely indeed .

Bought the black Calibra no 7 just before xmas , now this car is a weapon again once run in and a perfect flat chassis , got some spare slot it inline long can pods and a spare flat 6 R so going to try that in it as a comparison as a chassis test .

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It's good to see weight being added, I think my Opel weighs in around 80g


Print It, Build It, Race It, Improve It, Repeat...B)

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Keith, you have come up with almost identical weight and balance to me...... is this a case of "great minds think alike" or "fools seldom differ"  :lol:

Yeah Kevan, some out there in slot-land would have us feel guilty, they would indict us for being in possession of "lead sleds". 
I tend to think these modern RTR are very light cars OOTB, and without magnetic down-force of plastic tracks, even the smoothest car is a bit high for optimum balance in corners. 
After all, a basic brass chassis in an old WOMP would probably be heavier, even with a lexan body. And a lot of those were glued to the track with the old liquid magnet in a spray bottle.

From setting up a few of each model, and running two DTM national events, I used a weight allowance in the Alfas - are as going to in the Mercedes in 2020, to enable them to compete with an unweighted Opel, as the Opel were lower and wider. 
Both years, the track owner took out the event with an Opel, and one year another Opel was 2nd, but I had a 3rd with a CA35 and a 2nd the next year with a CA45.
Overall, we were hosting similar numbers of Opel and Alfa entries, and getting a good mix of models in the top 6 spots and down through the field. 
It equalised the models pretty well.

So a bit of lead induction to lower the COG, and compensate for things that happen on track can only be a responsible use of track time - well that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 


Walks upright Unaided  *  Ties Own Shoelaces  *  Can Mispronounce Own Name In Five Languages  *  Mostly Aims Rattle Cans Away from Self
 My Track Oakland Raceway V2     Our Club  HMBRC     

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Agree about this light RTR chassis have 2 Merc DTM and 2 Calibra DTM's and now the Skyline and just weighed the five of them and the Skyline is the lightest and the other 4 are not much heavier heaviest is one of the Mercs at 89-06, have found this is around the right weight for these inline cars , gives them a nice balance especially out of hairpin corners so smooth and just the right amount of rear movement to put the hammer down quicker.

On the lead thing always used it have found placing a bit of weight in the chassis especially up front  prefebl;y under the front axle or as near as possible make a lot of differance well plants the car into and out of corners , can't remember the last time i had a car that washed out at the front in corners .

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