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Router Braid Recess Bit

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After installing the braid use prepsol or similar to clean the invisible gunk off the new braid to ensure good conductivity.

 

I recommend cleaning the braid before laying it.....better adhesion....ever seen or had braid lifting?


John Warren

Slotcars are my preferred reality

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I get my braid with the tape applied ready to lay from Mr Slotcar, I know Peter cleans it prior to applying the tape, I’m not too sure weather both sides were cleaned because my car didn’t run well at first.

So I gave it a clean and bingo.

 

If applying your own tape or glue just emerse the entire roll into a large container of Prepsol and just wipe it dry as you use it out of the container.

 

Rick

Edited by aussieslotter

The best form of satisfaction is success.

www.scorpiuswireless.com

 

 

 

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I get my braid with the tape applied ready to lay from Mr Slotcar

 

Gee they make it easy for you these days...when I made my last track it took me a week to weave the braid.

It got a bit lumpy in parts but it is done now.

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John Warren

Slotcars are my preferred reality

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luxury!

 

we used to dream of being able to weave our own braid..... we were so poor we couldn't afford long enough strands to weave it together.....we had to glue tiny little fragments together piece by piece......

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luxury!

 

we used to dream of being able to weave our own braid..... we were so poor we couldn't afford long enough strands to weave it together.....we had to glue tiny little fragments together piece by piece......

 

Well lucky you, we had to dig our own ore out of a mine full of bats, then melt it down by burning the rags off our back for heat, then walk 20 miles back through the snow to our cave while fighting off the T-Rex

 

Bah kids, they don't know how good they have their hobby these days.


Walks upright Unaided  *  Ties Own Shoelaces  *  Can Mispronounce Own Name In Five Languages  *  Mostly Aims Rattle Cans Away from Self
 My Track Oakland Raceway V2     Our Club  HMBRC     

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I get my braid with the tape applied ready to lay from Mr Slotcar, I know Peter cleans it prior to applying the tape, I'm not too sure weather both sides were cleaned because my car didn't run well at first.

So I gave it a clean and bingo.

 

If applying your own tape or glue just emerse the entire roll into a large container of Prepsol and just wipe it dry as you use it out of the container.

 

Rick

 

Currently I would be extremely cautious of this pre-taped braid, unfortunately the glue on the back of the tape is not strong enough and I have the braid lifting and pulling away from the recess shoulders,module joints, straights, the corners are even lifting to the point they are cambering olike a Daytona banked corner, one example of what is called 'spider webbing' see the attached photo:

20200328-205051-1.jpg look at the outside braid recess shoulder, note the web like effect of the glue letting go

 

 

This is not MrTrax fault, this is the braid supplier issue, simply put the glue is not what it is advertised as super strength, there is not a simple fix for this, which I am waiting for Peter to get back to me with a workable, fixable solution.

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Johnno - looking at your picture, it appears that the braid on the outside of the slot/corner is pulling inwards.

 

When I have seen that before - both with 3M tape, and with glue solutions, it has been due to the braid being laid a little tight, as there shouldn't be any lateral stress on that braid to cause it to want to pull inwards away from the outer edge of the rebate. It should actually be laid very loosely so it is bunched up slightly and compressed a little on it's inside edge, so it almost wants to push outwards - if you get my drift.

 

I had a customer complain that the 3M tape which has been used by the kazzillion metres wasn't up to the job one time.

 

In that case, there were two problems

 

1 ) They failed to clean the room, let alone wipe down the rebate with a damp rag or vacuum it before laying the braid

2 ) Instead of laying the braid with a loose falling motion and almost force shortening it as they laid the outside of a curve, they had a guy pulling it off the roll in front and pressing it down, thus creating "stretch"

 

So after laying, the braid was under tension and wanting to "de-stress" itself by pulling shorter - ie cutting the corner.

It caused that effect in you picture - as well as lifting free ultimately.

 

Not that this helps you with a solution, but something people seeing this thread should be aware of.


Walks upright Unaided  *  Ties Own Shoelaces  *  Can Mispronounce Own Name In Five Languages  *  Mostly Aims Rattle Cans Away from Self
 My Track Oakland Raceway V2     Our Club  HMBRC     

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I also thought about that, however it isn't just myself with this issue apparently, solution/s are being worked on currently.

 

What initially got my attention was at the ends where the braid runs under the board for fixing, all ends have a bulge, every board, then this braid started pulling away from the braid recess.

 

I also initially thought that it might be environment related, however the track is in my lounge room and permanently setup, so no dismantling and re-assembling has been happening.

 

I personally believe the entire braid will require to be removed and relaid or replaced, awaiting solution/s as I mentioned.

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The problem with Mr Trax is a rare event.

Having laid 400 m of pre taped braid on my track and it has stuck 100% over a number of years is quite amazing.

 

 


The best form of satisfaction is success.

www.scorpiuswireless.com

 

 

 

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From what I have seen, read and heard it sure is one of those 1 in 100 year events for sure. I really need to say that this is not a MrTrax problem, it is a braid and glue problem from the braid supplier, unfortunately this has all just raised it's ugly head on the new supply of braid.

 

Work around's are being devised, including Peter sending me a braid roller to re-roll the track while I gently caress the braid back into the braid recess shoulder and other areas, fingers crossed this works.

Edited by Johnno

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Hi all. I have done only one track with braid about 10 years ago. Never had problem with it lifting.

 

Braid was supplied by SlotsNZ/Mark Burgess together with 3M tape. Based on Marks recommendation we cleaned both sides of tape first (at same time with fuelite I think) but not sure if we cleaned inset. Who thing was professionally paint with two pot enamel and baked. We coloured slot before taping using Marks recommended plastic bottles. Being novices we followed instructions to letter (not like my recent routing job) and it paid off. The 3M tape was laid in inset and backing peeled off as we laid tape. Around corners we just let tape lay itself. Basically we pushed a loop of braid from behind and it just followed line of inset. Once in place was firmly rolled to ensure good adhesion.

 

Much nicer to lay than tape but that was when I was richer. Fairly expensive but certainly worth the extra investment. Copper tape is cheap and nasty but except for corners is certainly very easy to lay. I think the slight inset helped. Even worse when laying for a rally track.

 

Regards Chas Le Breton (charlesx)

Edited by charlesx
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I also thought about that, however it isn't just myself with this issue apparently, solution/s are being worked on currently.

 

What initially got my attention was at the ends where the braid runs under the board for fixing, all ends have a bulge, every board, then this braid started pulling away from the braid recess.

 

I also initially thought that it might be environment related, however the track is in my lounge room and permanently setup, so no dismantling and re-assembling has been happening.

 

I personally believe the entire braid will require to be removed and relaid or replaced, awaiting solution/s as I mentioned.

 

I've found that when turning down the braid at the ends it is important to clamp the braid in the gain with a scrap of timber and use another scrap to turn down the braid. This creates a more permanent 90 degree bend and reduces the tendency for the braid to want to sell straighten and lift.

 

When first starting out, I made the mistake of laying braid under a carport on a hot day and when the braid cooled it contracted and pulled away from the corners. Lesson learned :-)

 

If the pin in the router bit is jamming another cause can be the mdf is flexing downwards making the walls of the slot close in on the pin. Keeping the track piece well supported will avoid this.

 

I agree, "I personally believe the entire braid will require to be removed and relaid or replaced, awaiting solution/s as I mentioned."

 

I have done enough braided track that I don't enjoy doing it anymore :-)

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www.sydneyslotcars.com

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I've laid miles of braid in my time and here's what I've learned.

 

Braid recess should be at least 1mm wider than the braid and a little deeper (0.1mm or more) than the braid thickness, the braid is then laid against the shoulder of the recess away from the slot. This stops the wheels on the cars catching the edges and stops the guide rolling up the inside edge.

 

When laying the braid hold it above the track so that it loops as it goes down (a picture would help here). The loop forces the braid weave to open a little so it's not stretched, and it can expand and contract with temperature changes. This is critical in corners or you'll end up with Johnno's problem above.

 

Glue? for almost all of the tracks I've built the braid was laid with contact glue, simply because it was prior to the high bond strength tapes being widely available. Contact glue has the advantage of not being fussy about the surface it goes on and is easy to repair. It's cost effective and you don't need to clean the braid, but it's messy.

 

High bond strength tape works well, just follow Rick's instructions above regarding recess preparation as a smooth surface is important.

 

Again, the most important thing is to loop the braid as it goes down to open the weave. Get a piece of your braid and curl it into a circle and see how it opens up, this is why you're having trouple with the corners Johnno, nothing to do with the glue or tape.

 

Hope this helps.

Edited by Garry J
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Cheers,

 

Garry J

 

Slotworx_Logo_Small.jpg

 

Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill

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One more thing,

 

When running the braid down a hole or a join, use a pair of flat nosed pliers to bend the braid at a sharp angle. This gives the braid a permanent kink, you'll need to squeeze it back together at the bend because it will widen out a bit but you need to make that sharp kink that won't try to undo itself over time. Also use a flat file to very slightly round the end of the braid recess at the join, generally one light pass with the file will do it.

 

If anyone wants some pictures I can probably organise something.


Cheers,

 

Garry J

 

Slotworx_Logo_Small.jpg

 

Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill

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I've laid miles of braid in my time and here's what I've learned.

 

Braid recess should be at least 1mm wider than the braid and a little deeper (0.1mm or more) than the braid thickness, the braid is then laid against the shoulder of the recess away from the slot. This stops the wheels on the cars catching the edges and stops the guide rolling up the inside edge.

 

When laying the braid hold it above the track so that it loops as it goes down (a picture would help here). The loop forces the braid weave to open a little so it's not stretched, and it can expand and contract with temperature changes. This is critical in corners or you'll end up with Johnno's problem above.

 

Yes this has been done as I can see the 1mm on the inner braid recess, so that is fine, however as Garry said and I thought, the braid has been pulled tight around the corners, hence the Nascar style banking on the braid itself.

 

Again, the most important thing is to loop the braid as it goes down to open the weave. Get a piece of your braid and curl it into a circle and see how it opens up, this is why you're having trouble with the corners Johnno, nothing to do with the glue or tape.

 

Hope this helps.

 

It does to some degree yes, the biggest issue is going to be convincing Peter (MrTrax) to repair this properly, I get feeling that relaying new braid will not happen unless I seriously push this. I have a braid roller coming to re-roll as I mentioned but gut feeling says it will just continue to lift, especially now that it has already lifted and more than likely has lost its sticking power and dust has settled.

 

Early days for now, just waiting for possible solution/s from Peter (MrTrax). I will keep this up-to date

Edited by Johnno

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I think everyone here is pretty much on the same page, and Garry especially, has just added a couple more good tips.

 

Sorry for the thread drift if it frustrates anyone. Let's keep any more good thoughts running.

 

Maybe at some point I can collate what everyone has said together into a single post for us to suggest final edits, then add the final(ish) version as a definitive sticky post somewhere, and a downloadable PDF file for people to take home for digestion as the "Auslot quickfire guide to routing and braiding"

 

SlotCarCorner have a very good one albeit a bit of a lengthy read, why can't we :)

Garry - if you have pics but no hosting source, holler. I can always put them up through my server.

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Walks upright Unaided  *  Ties Own Shoelaces  *  Can Mispronounce Own Name In Five Languages  *  Mostly Aims Rattle Cans Away from Self
 My Track Oakland Raceway V2     Our Club  HMBRC     

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This is my braid/track setup as Garry has said I’ve done, also my braid was from mr slotcar already taped awesome stuff as my track is now 4/5 yr old in western suburbs of Sydney with mid to high 40 degree summer day and with freezing winters still looks as good as the day I layed it down...you can see the braid is uniform on both sides of slot and within its self ...

1891-C810-4482-4-D39-81-CE-5406-A0-B4-D00-E.jpg

Edited by GAS41T
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Great looking job there Gas41T. Not sure my copper tape looks quite as good all round but not too far off. Unlike braid however it might be interesting to see how it lasts.

 

Regards Chas Le Breton

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Gas41T, that's perfect, anyone doing a braid job should hang this picture on the wall as a reference.

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Cheers,

 

Garry J

 

Slotworx_Logo_Small.jpg

 

Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill

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