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The New Slot-Fly Bmw 320


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#1 SlotsNZ

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Posted 25 March 2020 - 11:03 AM

FLY BMW 320 classic into a DTM Racer
With Slot.it having released the Mercedes 190 DTM Classic recently, the biggest hole in the range of models represented by the brand, is the BMW 320
– and possibly the Ford Sierra.
Our club rules are more broad than my DTM Classic event rules, to enable scope for those in club who like building cars; rather than just tuning a
standard model.
I looked at Scalextric, Ninco and FLY models The Scalextric BMW and Sierra were just too narrow, no Ninco Sierra available in Europe at a decent price.
So a Fly BMW it would be. I didn’t have any models with actual DTM liveries, but I did have a Fly BMW 320 Duo-kit, which consists of one complete car,
and a spare body and windscreen glass.
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Standard mechanical setup front motor, and deep tray interior in the blue car as pictured above.

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So I went about looking for a lightweight pancake interior and a donor chassis from Slot.it by preference. I needed a small amount of guide lead
– the wheels on a BMW are near to the front of the car.
The body is actually 1mm narrower than the CA35 Alfa, 2mm narrower than the other Alfas. But it sits nearly 3mm lower, just 3.5mm higher than the Opel
body height, so the handling should be fairly decent with a bit of low ballast.

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The interior is a lexan one from another model by Slot.it cut to fit, with a half driver figure from somewhere in the war chest – possibly MRRC.
Now I can use a regular inline podded chassis.
The Slot.it Alfa models had the correct wheel base, but too much guide lead. The Mercedes had a suitable short guide lead, but was too long in the
wheelbase. Surprisingly, the Opel porridge was “just right”. Only a bare 1mm too long in the wheelbase – do-able, and had the short guide lead I needed.

It also by chance had a single rear guide post which lined up perfectly. So I only have to replace the twin front mounts with a single centre mount.

So I took a complete Opel Calibra, and set the body aside. This was the cheapest way to get a complete rolling chassis.
The chassis needed quite a bit of trimming, as the BMW body is 1mm narrower than an Alfa CA35 chassis and about 4mm narrower than the Opel chassis
– and a bit shorter overall.

Posted Image

Standard chassis from a running Opel top of shot, and after trimming the donor chassis at bottom of shot.

More to follow.
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#2 munter

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Posted 25 March 2020 - 11:24 AM

Looks like fun, Mark.
I like that body model.

Re the body chassis connections...did you say two? I would suggest two in the front, out as wide as possible and one in the rear. That way you know what the body is floating on...not flopping on.
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#3 SlotsNZ

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Posted 25 March 2020 - 12:27 PM

View Postmunter, on 25 March 2020 - 11:24 AM, said:

Looks like fun, Mark.
I like that body model.

Re the body chassis connections...did you say two? I would suggest two in the front, out as wide as possible and one in the rear. That way you know what the body is floating on...not flopping on.

True John, true. The body already has those, and I do like that system - Ninco also used it, it might be easier to actually extend the existing front posts and drill the chassis..... hmm, food for thought.
I am so used to a 2 post system, my brain didn't think wide enough. - I blame the sleep deprivation caused by the urban tiger that has invaded our sleeping quarters.
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#4 big den

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Posted 26 March 2020 - 12:19 AM

Hi Mark.

You've probably saved yourself a lot of work and heartache by not being able to get a Ninco Sierra to slip on to the Slot.It Opel chassis.

I have been running Ninco's 50600 'Lui' Sierra at tracks in Hobart and Launceston (Tasmania) during the last year so I've just checked it against my own Slot.It Opel chassis. The wheelbase is just about spot-on, the guide-lead is OK but you would have to shorten both the front and rear of the Slot.It chassis to fit under the Ninco body.

However the biggest drawback is that the Ninco Sierra body has been designed to fit a 'step-down' chassis which sees the central section sitting about 4mm lower than the sides of the chassis that the side panels of the body line up with.

Mounted on a Slot.It chassis there could be a significant gap between the Sierra's 'door sills' and the chassis, resulting in an undesirable appearance.

Den

#5 SlotsNZ

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Posted 26 March 2020 - 09:14 AM

I think I got ya Den - I wonder - if I bought one - could I taper a lightweight interior out and downwards at 45 degrees from the middle area (once clear of motor and pod), so it lines up with the top edge of the door sills at the bottom of the windows, and hides the chassis./motor etc ?

- I was just looking at that and the LaBatt liveries I found somewhere else last night. Still tempted, though not sure if I can get them delivered in NZ.
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#6 charlesx

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Posted 26 March 2020 - 10:51 AM

Hi SlotsNZ/Mark.

You know I am a bit of a purist/scale/original equipment freak but when I saw your Fly model BMW with front mounted motor I thought of my standard Scaly Corvette Stingray that goes very well as magnet car. Assume if I removed magnet and replaced with lead it might continue to perform well but that is a future project. I remember Mike Wilson's Corvette Nationals car from a few years back. It left us all for dead. As my Scaly Muscle Car class Camaro is nearly 10 years old and still going like a rocket I probably need a new project Muscle car so the Corvette is on the horizon. This virus thing could provide such a window.

While I like your current project I tend not to produce another Slot-it or NSR car with a different body. Will still look forward to photos of your project when finished. Will be interesting to see if it goes as well as the Opel and that flying Alfa of yours. I have noticed my dunger now tuned by little brother Paul is now going very well. Only 2 laps slower than Thunderslot Lola GT on my new track which is running but still not quite finished.

Keep up the build projects everybody. They are a great inspiration.

Regards Chas Le Breton (charlesx)

#7 SlotsNZ

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Posted 26 March 2020 - 11:11 AM

Mike's Corvette actually had the motor moved to the conventional position, a light weight shallow pan interior and lots of lead.
- And of course, Mike was an exceptional driver. He had had success in Karts as national level; and solo bike racing as a professional in a speedway team in the UK.

I forget who ended up with the car - - - maybe Mike/Pieguy, and then Dave who now has the track ex both the Mikes.
But last time I saw it run, it no longer cuts the mustard against the muscle cars we are building for club racing.
I built a '70 Camaro for the Dunedin nationals in 2018, and top qualified by about .15 a second from Dion and the local guys from Pitlane. - It needs to be that fast just to podium at club.
If Mac and Dave had gone down, we might have swept qualifying.

HAH - I actually still have one of those 'vettes that I used to run for club and nationals, it seems like such a dog now.

The reason Fly mounted these and some others models as front engined is that Rafael Barrios senior had a fixation about putting the motor in a slot car, in the same place as in the real car.
But of course the real balance dynamics are totally different, and those drive shafts always introduce a lot of vibration, and energy loss.

Maybe that front engine can be workable for magnet racing on plastic with some rear weight to balance up, but it puts way too much weight forward for non mag racing on wood.
And in this case, it is pointless building car car that has no purpose running, - and this one has to compete with Slot.its and the best of all other builds.
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#8 charlesx

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Posted 26 March 2020 - 06:33 PM

Thanks SlotsNZ/Mark.

Yes and according to another Napier he was treating his tyres which at time I think was a no, no. It in fact remained so until I suggested we make it legal as it was impossible to police. Was still a great car in its time and agree he was a great driver.

I still like the idea of developing the Stingray and will initially at least keep with original motor configuration. I do agree however that the rear drive bearing is a problem as it eventually played up in my magnet version but still went pretty well.

Thanks for input. Looking forward to photos of final product.

Regards Chas Le Breton (charlesx)

#9 charlesx

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Posted 27 March 2020 - 07:33 AM

Hi again Slotsnz.

Suppose if everybody goes the Slot-it way you have little option but do not think it is doing SC racing any favour. Performance is not everything. Performance against similar cars no matter how configured is what it is all about to my mind.

Have to admit though that I do not have much luck with Slot-it and NSR. Have just recently got one of my NSR angle winders going reasonably well but still streets behind Moslers. Likewise Slot-it but occassionly I put a good race together.

Thought you had some purists in the HB. What about the guy with the vintage Porsche etc. The Pieguy too and I know Munter likes to dabble or at least he did.

That said NP may have slowed since dropping out of old National scene but I am miles I am still miles behind Paul and Mike except in modified Scaly classes so that is at least part of my problem. I do like to make my cars in a different configuration to most though so that does not help. Particularly like in-line or SW cars.

New track is up and running including dead strip timing so perhaps I can now raise my game. At least I can try.

Regards Chas Le Breton (charlesx)

#10 Shaynus

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Posted 28 March 2020 - 12:39 AM

I love the ingenuity, investigation and application of this project!
Keep the updates coming!

#11 SlotsNZ

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Posted 28 March 2020 - 10:52 AM

It lives ! - Warning, club guys know my builds often look a bit heath robinson, my attention to tidy finesse is not Dave or Mac like, let alone munter-ish.

Test fit. Looks okay, but the whole front is sitting 1.5mm clear of track. We can get this lower, yes we can, I want full guide depth.
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I will true down the front tyres another 0.5mm from the radius. I will lose the tyre decals, but I am a racer not a concours kind of guy. Then go to work on
making a front body post. I wanted to use the twin front mounts but they were a cm too short AND the point where the screws would have to go through the
chassis was right in line with the vertical rails of the chassis which give it stiffness.

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Plan B was mounting two rectangular plastic blocks against the chassis rails, as above, and glue a soft rubber spacer onto the top of each, aligned to the
body posts. I then screwed a body screw into each post, until the body sat at about the right height, with the screw heads sitting on the rubber spacers.

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Having achieved this approximate ride height, I made a body post by using some soft plastic tube with an inside diameter a bit under 2mm, and epoxyed it
inside some aluminium tube for strength and greater surface area for later fixing. I made the inner plastic shaft a bit longer than the aluminium tube, so I
could trim the plastic to fine adjust the post length. You can see the silver aluminium shaft I the picture above, just about touching the inside of the bonnet.
I ultimately trimmed about a mm off the plastic before I was satisfied it was the right length.

Posted Image

I then screwed it up tight through the chassis, roughed up the inside of the body shell for the epoxy, laid a generous amount on the body, some onto the
post, and just left the car sitting upside down, so epoxy could slide down the body post and meld with that on the chassis.
When the epoxy was cured, I loosened the body screw a typical one turn, adjusted the body screws on the inside of the body, so I had just about half a mm
of rock either direction, and fine adjusted axle ride height, and track width front and rear.
I also put a generous profile onto the outside edge of the front tyres, so I could maximise lowering of the body.

I have also fitted soft braid, put spacers between wheels and chassis posts, set the gear mesh so the contrate doesn’t rub on the motor shaft, lubed
everything, and all those other little blueprinting jobs you do.

Posted Image

Rolling car, sitting on track with a Slot.it Alfa 155. As you can see I have clearly achieved a ride height several mm lower than the Alfa. Stance is okay.
This lower COG helps the handling, and even though track is still 1mm narrower than the narrowest of the Slot.it models, - the CA35 Castrol and Jager
liveries, it actually runs very well without having added any additional weight. But I will play around with this over the next few days for optimal lap times
and predictability when pushed to the limit.

Posted Image

Happy to have created a runner that should be similar in lap times to the out of the box Slot.it models; which I can run at club.
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#12 Shaynus

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Posted 28 March 2020 - 01:15 PM

Slot.it " We don't make a BMW 320"
Mark "Hold my beer"

#13 lenny broke

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Posted 28 March 2020 - 02:15 PM

Nice job there Mark. (insert thumbs up emotothingy)
I like doing things like this but places I've raced at in the past frown upon this kind of witchcraft. I build'em anyway and run them at home for my own entertainment.

Keep up the good work
Alan

#14 SlotsNZ

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Posted 28 March 2020 - 02:37 PM

View Postlenny broke, on 28 March 2020 - 02:15 PM, said:

I like doing things like this but places I've raced at in the past frown upon this kind of witchcraft..

Alan

Our club has so many pointy hats, we could be a lodge or a midnight gathering around Stone Henge.
This is a mild application of what the rules allow. - I would have gone the 3D chassis route but
a ) I don't want no stinkin' virus shipped from Europe
b ) The only places I found a 3D chassis to fit this, just about make it cheaper by the time I paid postage, to to send M. a shed full of dosh and say "Hey, can you make me one of these and feel free to stamp out another 50,000 for yourself while you're about it."

Most guys run a stock Slot.it as per the rules for the DTM classic. The only one(s) that don't from memory, run a Scaley BMW 320, which is too narrow and can't keep up.

These are our club rules for all classes. - Pretty simple to understand, and have worked well since Mac took all the mystery out of definitions a few years back.
http://www.auslot.co...y-racing-rules/

Scrutineering consists of:
"does it look like an xxx", yes, tick.
"is there evidence of a G12 chassis or wood magnets", no, tick.
Scrutineering done for the year, and no one even noticed we did it between sausage rolls , chicken nibbles and talking about the latest news.

And rules for DTM class. - Something would have to be pretty special to beat a standard config, blueprinted Slot.it anyway.

DTM
Motor: Slot.it 21k (MX15)
Wheels: Open
Tyres: Open
Gears: Open
Axles: Open
Body: Stock.
Chassis: Donor chassis or aftermarket / printed chassis allowed.
Interior: Lightweight interior allowed but must have driver head & shoulders and some cockpit detail.
Remarks: Front axle height can be set or tubed. Motor can be braced to rear axle bushes.
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#15 slotmadmac

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Posted 29 March 2020 - 08:23 AM

Looks good Mark.

Edited by slotmadmac, 29 March 2020 - 08:24 AM.

Podiums are for short people.

#16 ZeGas

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Posted 29 March 2020 - 09:45 AM

I like the rocker idea, I have never thought of that, well done Mark, up there for thinkin' huh.
Cheers Grant
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#17 SlotsNZ

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Posted 29 March 2020 - 01:54 PM

HAH Zegas, that was a rescue job from option A that wasn't workable - I'd never have thought of it either.

I hadn't timed it, but when I did I was a bit disappointed today. 5.9 - 6.0 on my track compared with 5.5s for all the 6 or 7 cars I had set up for club, for testing and the DTM Classic.
So waved the wooden spoon over it again, adjusted various things, found one front wheel was rubbing on the wheel arch under load, so I trimmed a bit over a mm off the plastic bosses, so I had more wriggle room for washers and setting spacing. Taped the pod under the chassis, got it just to 5.7, added about 7.5 grams of lead around the chassis wings, and got it down to consistent mid 5.6s.
Final weight is 80.4 grams, and that with a lexan interior, so the Fly body as standard must be heaver by about 5 grams than a stock Slot.it Alfa. Even with the lightweight interior it is about 2 grams heavier.

The motor isn't a particularly fast one out of the box, it may wear faster as the brushes bed in. But at 5.6s it is good enough to run on a club night.
Happy now, can slide it into the car warchest draw
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#18 David Carter

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Posted 29 March 2020 - 06:42 PM

Nice one Mark, I guess I should finish my BMW 935 for this class

Oh and Mike (slotjockey) old scaly corvette ended up in Smithys ownership
If I recall it had a 25k nsr shark, slot it yellow gear and enough lead built up around the motor to sink a aircraft carrier. It was a very heavy car
My scaly corvette has had the motor moved to the back as well
Holdens rule the rest just drool
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#19 big den

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Posted 30 March 2020 - 02:21 AM

Hi Mark and others.

It took me a while to make the suggestion but there is another Slot.It chassis that lends itself to using the BMW, Ford Sierra and other bodies that Slot.It don't have in their range - the HRS. I suppose it comes down to how liberal the class rules are at your particular club.

Adjustable wheelbase, adjustable guide-lead, compatible with Slot.It pods and you don't have to butcher an existing chassis ... just cannibalise all the running gear from it.

Original HRS chassis and accessories may be a bit hard to source but now Slot.It has released the HRS2 range so supplies may be more readily available.

Hmmm ... I can sense a project or two in the air.

Den

#20 SlotsNZ

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Posted 30 March 2020 - 04:30 AM

Den
Yeah I had thought about using HRS but didn't investigate very far. But I don't like side body fixing, so I figured I may as well go with a "rolling chassis" the same as existing models in the class, - besides, I now have a brand new Opel Calibra body in the latest livery left over :)

Oh and I found one other chassis that was perfect fit. - Slot.it Matra
But the car comes sidewinder as standard, so I would have had to build up an online pod - You can't get sidewinder under these bodies.
So for anyone starting from a scratch chassis for something like this, the Matra is the right wheelbase and short guide lead.

Must get me a Sierra. Anyone reading who wants to sell a Fly or Ninco Sierra with a good body......
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