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Some Advice Please


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#1 Roath

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 05:07 PM

Hi guys

I've been having a nosey around here and many sites.

I'm looking at building a track , mostly as a project for me and my son.. with the idea that in the future he can invite friends around.

I used to race when I was a teenager at the Hastings slot car club at the old YMCA and I will enjoy joining in. ( Im now in Auckland)

I don't have a huge amount of space... but I have had a go at drawing up a 4.2 X 2.3 meter track. I really like lots of elevation changes and the long sqeeze on this track
You can see I have copied that idea.

Any suggestions? Is that straight long enough? ( about 4 meters). I could make the track larger, but this layout will fit the garage without changing things at all. Then again, I don't want to build it and be dissapointed it's too small / boring.
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About 100 mil between the 4 lanes.. a bit wider in the big corners ( grids are 100 mill) and I think the sqeeze will allow the two outside lanes to be able to passs each other only.


Many thanks for looking and any suggestions /concerns. :D

Rob

#2 gzminiz

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 06:35 PM

My track fits that same size (4.2 x 2.4 on the wide section and 2m on the skinnier side)

due to my size constraint I did a three laner (with pits) at 100mm spacing. I found it really hard to fit 4 lanes into that space. Just a thought. The few that have raced on mine seem to like it well enough

#3 Johnnyfly41

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Posted 25 April 2010 - 02:39 AM

I would say you are on the right track. No pun intended really.

A layout on grid paper to scale can show you a lot.

You might consider three lanes if it would let you get more track features, length, etc. into your space. It's a matter of preference and how many times you will actually have four racers. For me, three was perfect, On the rare occasions we have three racers, it sure is more exciting than two. For this old guy, I can keep a eye on one other car, trying to keep a lookout for two, thats way harder for me.

make sure your layout will race well in either direction, for the price of a DPDT switch, you get yourself another track for free.

Most folks in Oz go for braid. I wish I had. The tape is holding up, but my track is in the house. Long term and with lots of racing, you will probably wish you had used braid.

Line of sight, ease of marshalling your cars will dictate overpasses, squeeze locations etc. If you have not been there, go to www.oldslotracer.com hundreds of tracks there to view for ideas.

I routed my track entirely with a flexible plastic strip ala Luf's methods at oldslotracer. makes for a very smooth realistic flowing track and it's easy to do. if you are not familiar with this method, read up on it and get the strip kit, it's awesome.

You can see some of my construction pictures at www.pretzelcityspeedway.com go to gallery.

Best of luck and have fun.

John

#4 SlotsNZ

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Posted 25 April 2010 - 05:17 AM

Heya Roath, welcome aboard. I LOVE seeing more tracks getting built this side of the ditch!!!

Yep, like the guys said, 3 lanes is usually enough for home racing. Remember, you need marshals, and the gguys standing around marshaling create half the fun, as they wind up the drivers ad interact.

Most of us here in NZ, and a lot of ozzies build 3 laners, and find that is good for up to 8 or more people to have "balanced fun" on and off the controllers.
Also, 3 lanes generally means that you can go up and back comfortably twice in the width of 2.4 metres, without making any corners TOO tight. (Like your right hand side)

I like squeezes, but it takes people quite a while to learn to drive them properly - too much "red mist", too many de-slots for casual drivers, so I'd be using the extra space created by having only 3 lanes, to shorten the amount of track using the squeeze.

There's some great guys racing on home tracks in Auckland now, and many of them also race ont he periodic RTR nights at the Henderson club. There are some really experienced, helpful guys there, especially Dave West, who is drw21 on this forum. He or Alan or Mike who are all regulars here, would be useful guys to meet before you get down to the business of building the track.

Everything you need to build the track is available in NZ.
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#5 Roath

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Posted 25 April 2010 - 08:51 AM

Thanks heaps guys.. after reading all your thoughts , I think 3 lanes is the go.

I'll do some re drawing with 3 lanes , maybe take some more space and reduce the length of the squeeze.

I do like the long squeeze in the track I linked too, but your right, it's probably too hard ,especially for young kids.

John - thanks, my boy loved seeing the pictures of your son helping to build the track.. and wow, what an awesome track. You may notice the link I gave went to Luffs pages. Those are incredible tracks

Cheers for all the info Slotz.. This will be a winter build so I have some time before starting to get advice and hopefully get a good design sorted. I'm out Henderson way , so pretty handy , but then again I tend to be a bit stubborn and do everything myself even when offered help. :D

I'll put up a new drawing in a few days..

Thanks again

Rob

#6 kalbfellp

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Posted 25 April 2010 - 09:34 AM

I have to agree the squeeze section are for experienced racers, and then they still cause problems when the drivers get "enthusiastic" . If you intend this for FUN for the kids then have a look at the 3 lane track. We have about and even split with 3 and 4 lane tracks down here, BUT the 4 lane tracks all are 4.8 x 2.4 area.
Don't rush the design, much easier to change it on paper! :D

#7 Johnnyfly41

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Posted 26 April 2010 - 02:53 AM

I didnt do any squeezes and I used the strip to lay out my center lane then made the outer lanes parallel. I also made a concerted effort to have flared entry exits, straights are never really straight. At the end of my long straight, I jinked the cars over to the left before the big right hander. almost over did that little number. the outside cars usually tail kiss the wall right there at corner entry. it's not a problem, but I could have been a bit more subtle with it. I find it adds interest when there is slight irregularity. You can still drive the worst handling car flat out, but they jink around a bit and it looks cooler.

On my wish list would have been more elevation change, again, it looks very cool. Live and learn.

I drove a routed track that was small and tight with probably 18" of elevation change and squeezed turns. The squeezes in the turns were not as much of a problem as I had thought as when the cars are tail out you can really run closer than you think. My guess is, squeezing a turn might be better than a straight. the speed at the turn is slower, tail out lets the cars almost run nose to nose. it also would allow you a more driveable turn where space is tight than if you did regular spacing.

Lane spacing, I did 3.5" which I like, more touchy feely than my carerra track at 4". for the occasional 1/24th race it will either be tight or use the outside lanes. I am very pleased with this spacing.

You notice we all jump in here, it's because track building is so much fun. Even if we have a great track, we want to build another !!!

Keep the pics coming, always fun to see the builds.

John

#8 charlesx

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 10:20 AM

Agree on the 3 lanes. Hate the squeeze however as all that passing opportunity lost unless on opposite outside lanes. Straight appears fine and like sweeping alignment thru squeeze. Track looks like lanes should be fairly similar in length.

Will look forward to your next version after everybodies comments.

Always good to see a new track in planning stages. Good luck for the future.

Regards

Chas Le Breton

#9 Ember

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 10:54 AM

Like the plan Roath.

Alas, I can't comment on the build side of things as I'm stuck with plastic... but... Elevations do make for fun driving.

Those large esses on the right side would make for a great climb and fall. Bit of a twist here, an off camber dip there could make for a long term driving challenge that keeps folks coming back. Great for a private track.

Looking forward to watching this develop.

Cheers
Embs
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#10 gzminiz

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 11:15 AM

i agree with ember, i don't have any elevation changes other then my over pass and wish i had more (though it was my first one so I was worried about screwing it up, overpass was hard enough)

#11 munter

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 03:33 PM

If that is your space available on your plan then I would go deeper to the right and have a more narrow area there...
reason : marshalling cars?? can you reach them?
regards
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#12 Roath

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 04:48 PM

Thanks every one. I have been totally owned by work, working till midnight all week.. hence no update. I quickly drew this last weekend as a first hand drawn idea but havent had time to do more with it.

I have decided to move some things to the other garage and have more space for the track. This means I have 4.8 X 2.5 to play with. I want tons of elevation .. try to imagine this.

The back straight is a climb from right to left with a slight drop off near the end.. then wind down the Esses to the bottom. The narrower return is 3/4 down the steep hill, Then we wind back up the hill again on the right.

I love the sweeping elevation changes of Luffs tracks and I hope to slightly copy that.

I think this should work .. 3 lanes now and should be easy to Marshall. The narrow cliff road will be the squeeze and at least it's close to the drivers. The drawing is not quite whats in my head.. but gived you the idea.

Thanks again for the ideas and comments. Hopefully get some time to start clearing the garage this weekend!

Rob
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#13 Ember

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 04:59 PM

Now that should be a mighty fun challenge. Yes please.
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#14 kalbfellp

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 05:42 PM

Very much in the style of a "King" with a finger missing!

#15 gzminiz

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 06:20 PM

Only on suggestion is to do a crossover on the lower right turn. This will give you closer to the same lane lengths so the outside lane should keep closer in a fun race. Doesn't matter in club/real race as you drive each lane.

Looks great. Should be heaps of fun

#16 charlesx

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 06:59 PM

You are obviously set on that squeeze so that's fine. Your choice.

When you say drivers will be close to squeeze however I am not sure what you mean.

Where do you anticipate the drivers positions would be.

Agree also if you want tracks to be fairly similar you need a cross-over. You can get away without one with only 2 lanes but one is essential for 3 or more. True you can race on each lane in real competition (and combine results) but there is nothing like being able to contest lap after lap on even terms.

Regards

Chas Le Breton

#17 SlotsNZ

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 07:36 PM

Unless you really want a track which is a stop-start sort of style of driving, you need to open out those hairpins, 3 is too much, especially for lesser skilled drivers.

The 2 lanes do not need to run parallel, and it is not that hard to adjust the lanes, so that the supposedly "easier" or "horter" lanes have some extra curvature to help level out lap times per lane - or conversely, to straighten out a curve or two somewhat for the supposed slower lane.

That can make a track look very interesting.
If you go to the great site http://www.oldslotra...com/Videos.html look at video clip 4 of the Vanquish MG CanAm cars at bottom of page, you'll see one drive clear through a shortcut made for that lane, to help equalize it with other lanes.
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#18 munter

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 07:46 PM

Thats better mate...what about some dimensions?
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#19 Roath

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 07:50 PM

Hey Chas.

Squeeze will be be in the front of the track. Somewhere between the bottom left as the track goes to the right and up. Ideally I would like it in the small straight.. Not decided yet.

Drivers will be at the bottom... so much easier to access the cars than in the previous design where the back straight was the sqeeze.

Could I even out the lanes by swapping the outside lanes in 2 places?

#20 Roath

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Posted 30 April 2010 - 07:52 PM

View Postmunter, on Apr 30 2010, 09:46 PM, said:

Thats better mate...what about some dimensions?

At this stage I'm thinking 4.8 meters by 2.5 meters. It may end up bigger though.. every time I look at the space I decide to use more for the track..





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